I'm starting a new discussion to provide the Bose reply to this question
Question: Why do I have to turn up the microphone higher than guitar?
Answer: The output level of the guitar is louder than the output level of the microphone. That's why we have to turn up the microphone higher.
This is how my S1 Pro looks most of the time. The microphone is connected to channel 1 and the guitar is connected to channel 2.
More information:
There’s been a lot of discussion here lately about
Unity gain
The center détente is unity
Not enough reaction to the volume controls below unity
Not enough headroom when the volume control (for a microphone) is at 3:00 o’clock or greater
Let me address these points.
The volume controls are trim controls:
Note how quiet the S1 Pro is when there’s no input source and the volume, is all the way up – The volume controls are trim not preamp/gain controls
The concept of unity gain does not apply
The concept of headroom doesn’t apply
The center détente is a convenient point of reference, especially when you can't see the controls well at a gig
The power amps are running at full volume
When you turn the volume controls all the way up, you have reached the maximum volume the S1 Pro is capable of producing for that source
Note the clip lights. If you see red, turn down to avoid distortion. You have reached the maximum usable volume just below clipping
We hit maximum usable volume for an input is just before the clip lights come on. With a guitar with a preamp, that might be at 12:00 o’clock compared to a microphone at 3:00-4:00 o’clock. There’s no dysfunction here. It’s a reflection that the output level of the guitar is higher than the microphone.
I figured that the volume was due to output levels. It hasn't been a problem yet. I just didn't know if the volume was supposed to be almost non existant and then jump up suddenly at midpoint. If it is normal, that is fine. Making sure there wasn't a defect.
I'm starting a new discussion to provide the Bose reply to this question
Question: Why do I have to turn up the microphone higher than guitar?
Answer: The output level of the guitar is louder than the output level of the microphone. That's why we have to turn up the microphone higher.
? - ? - ? - ? - ? - ? - ? - ? - ?
Now what people seem to think is this is a comparison of THE volume of mic to THE volume of guitar. This is NOT A COMPARISON at all, the instrument volume knob works as it should.
We have started a new discussion for your question.
I figured that the volume was due to output levels.
Yes.
It hasn't been a problem yet. I just didn't know if the volume was supposed to be almost non existant and then jump up suddenly at midpoint. If it is normal, that is fine. Making sure there wasn't a defect.
"For people who notice very little difference in volume change between 0 and 12:00 o'clock, turning up the volume at the source will give them a greater audible difference below 12:00 o'clock."
This does not apply mic pos. (SM58) tone match mic switch should compensate for low signal mics as Bose does not offer a separate boost or phantom power.
The quote above is taken out of context, and in a different discussion.
Here is my comment in its larger context. For others reading along, note that at this point, I was talking about S1 Pro channel 3.
That's not surprising. If something is too quiet to hear, twice as loud may still too quiet to hear. You can keep doing that until you can hear it and then twice as loud will be noticeable. With a microphone (very low signal) you may not hear it at all until you get to around 11:00 o'clock when we reach the just-noticeable difference threshold. This point will vary based on the strength of the input volume.
The ideas above apply to S1 Pro channel 3 too (Bluetooth and wired connections). For people who notice very little difference in volume change between 0 and 12:00 o'clock, turning up the volume at the source will give them a greater audible difference below 12:00 o'clock.
The ToneMatch switch tunes the EQ on the channel to give great results with handheld microphones. You're correct, the switch does not affect the signal level. All you have to do is turn up the volume, likely over 12:00 o'clock.
You can add your suggestions about making the ToneMatch switch boost a microphone signal, and adding phantom power to
I find the volume with the SM58 quite inadequate unless turned up beyond 3 o clock. If I add an impedance matching transformer it is much better. This was suggested by Shure tech support. Bose told me they test all their systems with the SM58 so it’s surprising this is an issue. I should not have to add an impedance transformer!
Bose is using a technical means that was abandoned by some amp companies some years ago, where they used a split for low level and line level. 12 o'clock being the the mid point. Low level mics like the 58 are at a voice level at 12 o'clock. This was extremely unpopular in the past and amps in the past did away with this by master volumes, because people wanted control of their volume and always felt the unit was defective by not audible response below 12 for weak output mics. Bose needs a master volume. The 58 is a very low output mic, I solved this issue by running my mic thru a balance direct box. If you use some pre or something like voice live or a boss voice you can put your mic in the balance output and internally boost the output to get the volume to a decent level. They also have phantom power so you can use condenser mics I also use a volume pedal this allows me to set the mic and line levels and then add the volume with my foot pedal. I personally feel this is poorly thought out for a unit used for busking or singer songwriters. This is as simple as I can explain this without going into electronics but this was how I found a solution. = I set my volume for the 58 and boost it thru a balance out from DI box or Boss VE-20 I use a volume pedal to then control the volume with my volume pedal.
Thanks for your explanation but my comment is about solving the lack of a master volume on this unit also the lack of a boost or phantom power. As I mentioned by using a pre of some sort to boost my 58's inaudibility before 11 o'clock and using a volume pedal to solve the lack of ability to set the line level of instrument and mic without repeated fiddling. This has been a topic of discourse. If you feel this does not apply you can delete it.
I do not like the lack of a master volume, just asking for trouble. If I have any feedback issues I throw in a parametric into the loop of effects. S1's reverb is ok not crazy good but will do for vocals. I throw in the acoustic fly rig by tech 21 good effects: reverb, chorus, delay, compression, and eq with mid sweep plus notch filter in one very little pedal just about twice the size of a pencil box. (12.5”l x 2.5”w x 1.25”h • Weight: 20.7 oz) Very small footprint can fit into a small backpack or carryon, great for instruments. The heaviest thing I have going is the volume mini but it allows for complete volume control without having to play tag with the volume on the unit trying to match the guitar and vocals. No accidents with the pedal. The mic pre works well also the is control on my board. I am not running back to the speaker testing balance and running back to the speaker. I like the foot control, would it be nice if Bose came up with a unit with a removable panel with effects and volume for channels so one would never have to play with back and forth adjustments. Think about it Bose no is doing it as of yet.
Wanted to chime in on this topic. I have had my Bose S1 pro for more than 2 months now, and could not be happier with the clarity. Mainly use it for Karaoke at home, and I find the SM58 volume sufficient around about 6 o'clock position for home applications. One way I could manage to get more volume was of course using an external mixer, but you have to be careful with feedback, etc. in a close space. One other way I tried was sing an XLR splitter, where one end goes to the microphone output XLR cable, and BOTH the other ends feed into each of the 2 inputs of the Bose S1 Pro. I set both S1 volumes to around 5 O'clock and get really good volume from the SM58 with room to spare. I think it can still go higher in bigger/outdoor spaces where feedback is less of an issue. Of course with this arrangement, you cannot plug in guitar, etc., in the S1 pro, but at least gives you an option for karaoke applications, or if you don't need to insert your guitar. Hope Bose can confirm if this is an acceptable way to connect a microphone.
